Joe Panzarino "Shoot" Interview

It seems that once Ricky O was given the opportunity to tell his side of the events that were going on in JCW over the past few weeks, he opened up a forum that everyone now wants to be a part of.

Within 48 hours of Ricky O's interview, I was contacted by Joe Panzarino, promoter of NWS. Mr. Panzarino called my home and left a message on my answering machine requesting an "open forum like Ricky O. had because what I need to say can't fit into 10 Questions", Mr. Panzarino then must have thought that he hung up the phone when in fact, all he did was switch over to his other line where Gino Moore was waiting. Mr. Panzarino then sang a lovely rendition of "Schwanee, How I hate you, How I hate you, my dear old Schwanee" before filling Mr. Moore in on his request for the open forum.

I emailed both Mr. Panzarino and Moore with the following:
"Word to the wise... when done leaving a message on someone's answering machine, be sure to HANG UP THE PHONE before continuing your conversation with the person on the other extension, otherwise it makes you look like a total ass."

The response from Joe:
"I thought my rendition was the best but u still have not answered the question do I get to do an open forum like Ricky Doe boy. Or has our singing really turned u off." - Joe

Wow, no acknowledgement of his screwup whatsoever all he cares about is that free publicity.

Being the fair and reasonable person I am I figured I'd give Mr. Panzarino his wish and interview him in "an open forum". The following is that interview. I think the comments from Mr. Panzarino speak for themselves, spelling errors included ;)

As has been the case with our previous open forum interviews anyone with any questions, comments, or rebuttals (which we are more than willing to print) may be sent to cactusb@wrestlingclothesline.com or jim@wrestlingclothesline.com.

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Brett: Let's start at the beginning.... How did you first get involved in the wrestling business and in what capacity?

Joe: I got involved wrestling as my first passion of Roller Derby was dying out. I got involved with a gentleman named Scott Howard who took me to my first show (a Puerto Rican show down on 4th Ave in Brooklyn) where they were short a referee and since I had some knowledge of the business (always being a fan), was thrown into a match. I had gone to the old Garden and my dad schlepped me down to the old Sunnyside Gardens. Eventually worked my way into the promotions, ring announcer, occasional referee. I actually wrestled professionally for 3 years (1976-1977...ring names Crazy Joe Bennett, Adolph Von Sthuckher...even back then had a sense of humor). Worked with guys like Eddie Valentino (aka Gorgeous George Junior), Handsome Pete McKay, Carlos Colone, etc. This is where I developed my mic skills for the manager gimmick. Business was no different then...you drove half way across the country for $25.00. Stayed in and out of the wrestling and roller derby business and actually did the WWWF ring announcing for Vince Senior's Five Borough Long Island Promoter Tommy D. This was around 1980-1982. Around 1995, hooked back up with Tommy D. starting helping him promote shows in the Brooklyn area, eventually started obtaining venues in New Jersey. Tommy D. came and left, then came Barry Geiger (very short lived), and in the winter of 1998, hooked up with Dennis Carluzzo/NWA NJ (even knowing his reputation...kept a close eye on him). 1998-winter of 1999, every show I promoted was a sell out. A lot of problems arose with Dennis...unpaid bills, complaints form sponsors on the content of the shows...he lost control of the locker room. January of 2000, Gino Moore, Rubenstein and myself broke away from Dennis and Sports Entertainment Group took over the NWA membership. I brought the venues and building contacts to the table, some financial backing, Gino brought the corporation, financial backing, sound equipment, etc. to the table, Rubenstein brought his so-called ability as a referee and lawyer to the table. You asked the question how did we get to NWS today...as we were building up to the summer of 2002 and some big scheduled shows down in Ocean City, Maryland, where there was a lot at stake, Rubenstein was less and less apparent at the shows, taking jaunts off to Japan, contracts were left in my hand, and in fact just about everything was left up to me. The only thing bigger than Rubenstein's ego was the lies he perpetrated with him being a lawyer, which had most of the industry fooled, when in fact, he was nothing but a bus driver and sometime union mediator. Hopefully, whoever this turd is working for now, will get to know what a master manipulator and crap artist he is. Too many people including us, have found out that Rubenstein spends everyone else's money better than they can. The sad thing is that Rubenstein doesn't realize what a joke he really is around the locker room and some promotions actually refer to him as "Taz" the way he stands there with his arms folded and others like ours use him in reference to when one is evacuating one's system...in other words...I'm taking a Fred or I just took a good Fred.

Brett: How did you and Gino Moore finally arrive at where you are today, with the NWS? Exactly what are your roles in NWS?

Joe: Come August 2002, Gino and myself finally came to our senses and unceremoniously dumped Rubenstein. Gino notified the NWA that he would become point person and Fred was no longer involved with Sports Entertainment Group. As of the date of this writing, this is still in a legal bind and there are many investigations going on including unlawful practice of law committee looking into the Rubenstein Matter. While I really can't comment on that, needless to say, since he left, the tension is out of the locker room, new people have stepped up to the plate, and for the most part, in two days, do more than Fred did in two years (they know who they are and Gino and I thank them). Better news is at the end of the show, Gino and I have a habit of looking up to the stars and as Gino would say "La Grouge" in Italian...meaning the black cloud is gone. Basically, that's how the NWS got started...I run the NWS and Gino runs the NWA Jersey events which we did 7 of this year. I work for Gino at the NWA Jersey events, Gino comes and works for me at the NWS events...that's our current set up.

Brett: Who is in charge of the creation of characters and booking in the NWS?

Joe: Basically anyone who comes up with a good idea. If Gino and myself like it, we'll toss it around, ask for input from other creative people in the company and we run with it. As far as the booking, I do around 95% since this is what I do and Gino has other businesses to run.

Brett: The whole Hasheem Ali character was obviously created simply to try and get a reaction out of people (just like when McMahon had Slaughter turn to Iraq during that period of time.. and no, I'm in no way comparing you to McMahon, more showing how the whole gimmick was simply a rehashed one). Did you get the reaction you wanted from the gimmick? Do you think that stooping to the lowest level possible and using a very serious, real life situation, as a way to get a character "over" was the best you could come up with?

Joe: Hey Brett...I take offense to the question. Let's get it right...it's Hasheem "Chemical" Ali and his partner Saddam Insane, managed by (if anybody gets it) Mohoward Gottheheaves al-getz. Now you should be comparing me to McMahon...we have heard that the WWE was actually planning on using this same sort of gimmick (much as they are now using the Le Resistance...we started with the French-Canadian Connection). You asked me if it was rehashed...ABSOLUTELY 100%...but to the new generation of fans that we cater too...all new!. You asked me if we got the reaction...ABSOLUTELY 100%...it's over every time. And it's just your opinion of we're stooping to the lowest level possible...as far as we're concerned it works...the chants of USA, USA blast the building This is no different than The Rock cutting a scathing promo with Mick Foley with La Resistance and constantly conjuring up images of what cowards the French are...doesn't that make it dangerous for American's who go to France? That's why they're always mad at Americans. Doesn't that hurt the tourist industry? The French treat American's like crap..but I don't know of any tourist going over to Iraq lately. This is what we feel is the best character created recently since sheet writers like yourself really don't invest any major money into wrestling...this at least got your attention...and the fact that to this day, the fans chant USA, USA every time Ali and Insane hit the ring, says a lot about the patriotism that is so popular these days.

Brett: Everyone knows that I am not a fan of ANY promoter putting themselves into any storyline, whatsoever. I have pointed it out time and time again, in many promotions. How can you, as a promoter, put yourself in angles on your own shows? Is it simply for your own ego or do you actually think you add to the show (and if so... how so?)

Joe: You must remember Brett, before I was nearly a full time promoter, I was doing the Dapper Johnny gimmick...doing it very well. As a matter of fact, many wrestlers would request for me to go to ringside with them. Even though I don't do it as much as I used to (truthfully I am too busy doing other things the night of the shows), I will still occasionally come out as Dapper Johnny and am always looking for someone to do it as good as I do...I have yet to...and will keep looking...already using Mohoward Gottheheaves al-getz, Mussolini, and sports agent Ryan Maher as managers, and they are good, however, I am still looking for something with that special "something" that can get under the skin of the fans. I'd love to bring Jim Cornett, Paul Bearer in, but the show budgets just can't support it. So to keep the fans happy and making money, we do what's best.

Brett: To follow up on that... how can you have the audacity to get pissed off at paying customers who don't like the fact that you book yourself on your own shows (not to mention booking yourself into EVERY match on one show)? Hell, can you even explain the logic behind you being at ringside and having to get on the mic during EVERY match on a show? (which you have done at at least 2 shows that I have attended)

Joe: I am actually a bit confused on this one...I don't know of any fans that got pissed off at me, unless it was just you and your contingent of Internet marks, that I didn't let you all in for Free at a Keansburg show a couple of years ago. There's a guest list, not a glutton list and for you to walk in with more than one other guest, I am the one who has to answer to the sponsor...not you. Now if Rubenstein invited them all, the coward never had the balls to tell me...you're the one who took it out on me...whether you like me being in on the angles or not...you decided to delete my name from the reviews.

Brett: Wow. Talk about writing a great fiction story. The fact is that I was invited to the show. Just me. Not a bunch of gluttons. Not a bunch of "internet" folks. I approached. I asked about it. You snapped. I asked Gino Moore about it. He knew I was invited. I was allowed in. Everyone else in the group paid, as they all expected to. Where you came up with your story is beyond me. Granted, it was your way of trying to take yet another shot at Fred BUT at least try and keep the story accurate.

Joe: Bret like you we can rehash this to we are blue in the face but I remember what I remember and yes it was you and your crew that wanted to come in for nothing and also seems to me that you are avoiding answering why you purposely left me out of the reviews good bad or indifferent you became judge jury and executioner by doing what you did no different than that Philly load and yes any time I get a shot at my ex partner I will let everyone know what a true monumental PRICK he is. If someone stole from you I am sure you would feel the same.

(side note from Brett: I'm avoiding questions? Notice there is still not ONE word of him trying to explain his HAVING to involve himself in EVERY MATCH on a show... could the reason that he was in EVERY MATCH be the reason I omitted his name?)

Brett: You have publically told numerous people on numerous occassions that you do not like me. Period. The ONLY reason you could possibly have for not liking me, since I have never said or done ANYTHING to you, is the fact that I complained the you were involved in EVERY SINGLE MATCH on TWO shows that I attended. As far as the "fans"... I'm a fan. I do not get paid in any way, shape, or form from the wrestling business. I do not make money off my site (although those promotions, like yours, who get all the free publicity in the world from me must make money off the fans who read about the show on my site then come out and buy tickets.) BTW, I notice you never responded to my question of how you can possibly explain having to be involved AND on the mic for EVERY MATCH ON ONE SHOW.

Joe: Seems you and I have a different opinion and what you saw and I know what transpired I disagree with you and you with me. Like I said yes you give us sheet time but thetas your call and nobody putting a gun to your head to have the forum.

The problem is you Internet folks really yield too much power as far as I am concered...theirs especially one load out of the Philadelphia area that should get his ass out of his house and get himself a job instead of sitting there acting as God on the Internet. 15 years ago, you wouldn't have the Internet to play with and would all keep your mouths shut and still come running to the shows and pay for the tickets. That's probably the only time any of you actually invested money into a wrestling show. Now as so called Internet writers, you are allowed into the shows for free...what have you done for the promoters lately (even though your site has been one that has been fair to NWS).

Brett: So because you have a problem with "one load out of Philadelphia" you harbor anger against fans like myself who simply try and spread the word about indy wrestling to fans who may be interested? Where's the logic there? Where's my "power"? Again, I make no money off my site, the wrestling business in general, or anything regarding wrestling. Where's my power in the business? I have none. I'm honored that you think I do though.

Joe: If you chose to believe I harbor anger that's your prerogative I know better why heck I even like you prior to contrary believes.

Brett: Again, you really should make sure that you know what you are talking about before you state inaccuracies. I pay for every show I attend. Why do I pay? I pay because I am a fan and I have the right to state my opinion (positive and negative) about any show I pay to see. I am not "allowed into the shows for free" and if you could provide me with any proof of shows, other than the 2 NWS shows and one or two JCW shows, that I have been "allowed into for free" over my past 15 years of attending shows I would LOVE to see it.

Hell, 4 free shows in 15 years. Throw into that the gas, tolls, wear and tear on the car, and other expenses to get from Long Island to all the indy shows. Wow.. I've got a great scam going here? How am I not a multimillionaire? Add to that the hours I spend updating the site with news of upcoming events, etc.... the time it takes to conduct and post interviews to give people like you added publicity... the write ups I do of shows I attend (negative or positive, any publicity is good publicity). So.. about your comment regarding "That's probably the only time any of you actually invested money into a wrestling show"... care to open your trap again?

Joe: Bret again I reiterate its your choice but once you start making critical comments or deleting people places and things and even if you get into one show for nothing in my opinion and its just mine and mine alone that then you are more than a fan put part of what make this thing of wrestling tick.

Brett: Why do you feel the NWS is able to consistently draw decent size crowds when many other promotions in NJ are floundering?

Joe: Hey Brett...you actually contradicted yourself on the previous two questions. If It is as bad as you say I am it seems you're the only person having a problem coming to my shows.

Brett: How am I contradicting myself? I asked you how you can explain involving yourself in every match on a show (a question you never answered). I then asked why you draw decent size crowds. I didn' t mention the fact that the ONLY people I ever hear the numbers from are Gino or your webmaster's press releases. I didn't mention that I have rarely had an actual fan in attendance send me in a report of a show with an estimated crowd size. The fact that I am accepting the numbers that you and your promotions press releases as fact is funny enough. Tell me a promoter that doesn' t inflate the numbers.

Joe: Well, OLE pal of mine let me take your stance on this one you stated that you gotten into free just 4 shows over the last 15 years well how bout I take your word on it and you take mine cause that's all we have as far as you and I go. But there is that one other thing like hey where still in business and it staring at you write in your face I mean come on if where booking talent and there all getting paid we must be drawing. And on another note I do not believe in inflating attendance I always try to keep it as close to the amount in the building as possible. And another thing we will not do if on a rare occurrence we have to cancel a show we always tell the truth why weather its bad sales or some other reason we have always come out with the truth that's my policy WILL NOT BLAME SOMEONE ELSE UNLESS WE HAVE THE PROOF. I hope this ends our little chat and I hope we do not have to have a pissing contest.

(side note by Brett: Ask the promoters of CSWF, JAP, ECWA, NYWC, WXW, JCW, GCW, and any other show I've been to in the past. I pay for my tickets. There's my "proof". BTW. No pissing contest here. Just your request for an open forum being granted)

Brett: How do you plan on continuing to draw fans to your shows when it seems the indy wrestling scene, as a whole, is hurting right now?

Joe: I'm not giving away my secrets...let's just say the team I have works well together in all aspects to make the show a success. Everyone else can figure it out for themselves..

Brett: What is your thought of the current state of indy wrestling, especially in NJ where it seems there is an over saturation?

Joe: I think indy wrestling as a whole has a lot more Grade A talent on it than it did just 5 years ago. As far as over saturation goes, how many times can you go see the circus...after a while, even that gets tired.

Brett: There have been many accusations thrown around from one promotion to the next regarding tampering with shows, stealing venues, etc... Tell me your opinion regarding the following promotions and people (and feel free to add anyone or thing I may leave out)...

3PW and Jasmine St Claire and Blue Meanie -

Joe: We're still looking for the "Smoking Gun" against Gino Moore as to their accusations that Gino Moore had something to do with their recent cancellations. Where is their "crack" reporters doing these investigations? 3PW doesn't bother us, as far as I am concerned, that's a porn/buslesque show and NWS is vaudeville. Unfortunately, even though Brian is a good guy and Jasmine is a sweetheart,but with her background, I doubt 3PW will be doing any church fundraisers any time soon.

Brett: JCW and Ricky O -

Joe: Ricky should get the salt and pepper out, this way when the stupid bastard puts his fat food in his fat mouth one more time, he'll have something to eat.

Brett: JAPW and Fat Frank (Iadaveia) -

Joe: Only met Frank once and JAPW/ROH run different promoters than we do...we cater to the family...they to the hardcore...but there's a good working relationship.

Brett: CSWF and promoter Billy Firehawk -

Joe: WHO???

Brett: The late PCW and promoter Donnie B -

Joe: Unfortunatley, the word late is not in front of Donnie B.

Brett: The NWA in general -

Joe: NWA in general needs the Jarretts more than the Jarretts need the NWA. Prior to the current board that's in existence now, the NWA has been mis-handled by the prior boards for the past few years. Too many unanswered questions, too many missing this and missing that, and just not enough balls on them to work together. On possibly the new board, reject certain parasites within the organization. Hopefully they'll see the lightbefore its to late.

Brett: Gino Moore -

Joe: The most maligned character I've ever met in pro wrestling. If there were a show scheduled on the moon that got canceled, the promoter would blame Gino. I know Gino intimately and if Gino Moore did everything that everybody said he did, he'd be 180 pounds and running the New York City Marathon. ON a personal note...nobody can elaborate more than Gino on any particular subject, but he is a stand-up guy and will have your back in time and need...more than I can say about some of the other lily-livered pieces of crap in this business.

Brett: What ever happened to the United Wrestling Syndicate? What was the whole idea behind it in the first place and why did it never seem to leave the ground?

Joe: The idea came from Carmine Sabia. Certain aspects did leave the ground and were implemented albeit at the quiet level. I still think it's a good idea, that's if Carmine opens up his eyes to see Ricky O. rear-end him.

Brett: How do you determine what wrestlers you will use on a show? For example, Al Snow is working many indy shows up and down the east coast. Is booking him a good draw if he just worked several shows elsewhere in NJ just weeks before? How do you determine which younger talent (like IWF guys) will work a show?

Joe: Basically seeing what title bouts we have, things that have been used in the area before and on every show, one or two decent ticket sellers (again, trade secrets...I'm a success...they're not). As far as Al Snow went, yes Al has worked many other shows in New Jersey, but the point of booking with me, he had not appeared in the Ocean County area before and we felt the fans deserved to see him without traveling 50 miles north.

Love working with the IWF. Who ever comes out of Camp IWF to work NWS shows is always professional and trained to the best of their abilities. I'll make a call to Kevin Knight, tell Kevin what I am looking for and Kevin will make his recommendations. Kevin says they can work...then they can work. IWF, as far as I am concerned, right now is probably the premiere training facility here in the tri-state region.

Brett: What 5 matches that NWS has had stand out in your mind as 5 of the best the promotion has ever had?

Joe: Julio Dinero & Miss Kara vs April Hunter and Slick Wagner Brown
Crowbar vs Danny Doring
Mike Kruel vs The Great Blazini
Power Company vs Canadian Connection
Roadkill vs The Wall (may he rest in peace)

Brett: Thanks, Joe for a very entertaining and informative "open forum". I've learned MORE than you could ever imagine and I hope the readers of the Wrestling Clothesline have as well.

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I have received quite a lot of email in regards to this interview. Below is a small sample of some of the emails I have received. (Those who have given permission, have their name listed. Others, who wish to remain anonymous are stated as such)... Feel free to send in your comments, complaints, etc. and let me know if they can be posted here as well!! ...Brett

-- A quick shout out to let you know the piece on promoter Joe Panzarino and his group was one of the more compelling things I've had the pleasure of reading on this or any wrestling site. Came across as a slice right out of a Goodfellow's movie! It's nice to see someone who actually asks the questions fans and insiders want to know. If they handed out awards for excellence in pro wrestling journalism--this piece would get my nomination. Excellent job, Brett.....Take Care: Matt Christensen....Vince DeCarlo Productions

-- Nobody can do anymore to either Joe or Gino than they have done to themselves... Anonymous

-- The "open forum" by Joe was quite possibly one of the greatest fictional writings I have ever read in my entire life. If every promoter is this pompus and arrogant, I fear for the future of wrestling... Robert D'Nafrio

-- ROTFLMAO. That was the most hilarious thing I have ever read. Thanks!... Kathy Burmin

-- I do not know who Gino Moore is or Joe Panzarino so I guess I'll never make it anywhere in this business...Barry Daniels

When using any of this information give proper credit to Cactusb and the Wrestling Clothesline at http://www.wrestlingclothesline.com

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